‘Ghosts’ Star Danielle Pinnock on Alberta’s Hidden History & Attending Ventriloquism School

[Warning: The below contains MAJOR spoilers for Ghosts Season 5 Episode 8, “The Life and Times of Esther Greene.”]

Ghosts‘ latest episode unveils even more about Alberta (Danielle Pinnock) than ever before as the jazz singing ghosts’ true name and former act came to light in “The Life and Times of Esther Greene.”

When “creepy” Todd (Rodrigo Fernandez Stoll) returns to Woodstone, he’s now a famous podcaster that Sam (Rose McIver) is hoping to get an interview with to promote her book. Needless to say, things don’t go exactly to plan, but when the subject of Alberta is raised, Thorfinn (Devan Chandler Long) notices that Todd’s search for her past is murky because of the fact that she changed her name.

Ultimately, she reveals that she changed her name because she killed someone, but in a true confession to Pete (Richie Moriarty), Alberta reveals that she had once been named Esther Greene, but when her music career didn’t take off, she opted for ventriloquism. In order to shake the act, she ended up destroying the puppet (apart from the hat, which she still wears today) and changing her name to Alberta Haynes so she could leave the past behind.

Just as Todd’s about to leave, Alberta is convinced to share this information in exchange for his cooperation in promoting Sam’s book and Jay’s (Utkarsh Ambudkar) restaurant. Despite Alberta’s hidden past, she’s still the same feisty character fans love. Below, Pinnock takes us inside Alberta’s episode, including prepping that ventriloquism act and diving deeper into Alberta and Pete’s romance.

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Alberta’s ventriloquism origins are so fascinating. Did you have any say on her original name, Esther Greene?

Danielle Pinnock: No. So there was a joke in Season 4 where she’s trying to give Sam terrible scammer advice, and she says very quickly, “You think my real name is Alberta?” I was like, Oh, maybe Alberta Haynes is just her performance name. And so to get this glorious flashback, I love every time we get to go back into the Harlem Renaissance in the 1920s because it just looks so beautiful. It also gives me an opportunity to have another costume and to touch props as well. And of course it would be ventriloquism, you know what I mean? I asked for something very odd this year. And that’s exactly what Emily Schmidt gave me, and so I’m so grateful. It is so funny. I went to puppet school for it. I got that script on a Thursday, we did the table read, and that Thursday evening, I was in ventriloquism school. So I am truly just building up my actor’s toolbox one season at a time. I’m learning how to sing, I’ve learned how to tap dance, I’m doing all kinds of stuff, and now I’m a ventriloquist. I love it.

Wow, I thought it looked authentic, but you really had to train to pull off Alberta’s ventriloquism skills onscreen?

Oh yes, for hours and on the weekends because I’m a little bit like Beyonce… if I’m not getting it right, I’m going to just keep working, doubling down. And so yeah, it was a Thursday, and then we shot it on Tuesday. It was only a couple of days we had, my god.

Bertrand Calmeau / CBS

Thorfinn is the first one to call out Alberta’s missing history being tied to her name. Why is she so reluctant to share this secret? 

In the words of our good sister, Brené Brown, she has shame surrounding it. And I think in her time period, ventriloquism was a low-grade talent, and all she ever wanted to do was be a jazz singer, but no one was accepting of her doing that. And so she had to be reborn in some ways into the braggadocious diva that we know her to be. But Alberta Haynes is her confidence, Esther Green is her trying to navigate and figure out, and make ends meet. Even though that is her real name and who she is, audiences weren’t accepting of that. I think in that time period… it’s so interesting because it’s how shame evolves as well. It’s actually not that deep, but it’s like somebody could get excommunicated or called out or gossiped about. Those are the kinds of things that are so interesting, and now we’re in a time where people wear jeans to church. You know what I mean?

It’s so interesting in this episode how shame evolves, and Pete is there to be like, “Hey, babe, you have nothing to worry about. Your secret is safe, but you can tell other people.” And that’s why we need good partners. We need encouraging partners. And that’s why I think that Pete is so perfect for Alberta because her vulnerability is safe with him.

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'Ghosts': Thorfinn Forces Alberta to Reveal Why She Changed Her Name

Yes, Pete and Alberta are so sweet this season. What has it been like getting to explore their relationship this season after building it up for so long?

You know what the thing is, even in this relationship, I still think it’s a slow burn. You know what I mean? That’s the thing that’s really funny about the show, because Pete died in the eighties, so they’ve known each other for at least 40 years. You would imagine that after 40 years together, even platonically, they would’ve had some of this information shared, which goes to show that we can have secrets up until the day that we die.

I think there’s so much road that still needs to be covered between them, and so many great storylines that are also to come. The other thing that I think is so exciting is [the showrunners] said to me at the beginning of Season 5, you don’t really know a person until they’re getting into a relationship. That’s how we love to find things out about characters. And so we’re going to really find out what they love most about each other, but also what makes them tick as well, which I can’t wait for audiences to see. And working with Richie Moriarty is a dream. He is truly incredible.

What do you think about the fact that “creepy” Todd is always associated with Alberta’s storylines?

Oh, he’s in limerence with her, which is so funny, and this woman is dead. Give it up, Todd. But honestly, also without Todd, the world would not know about Alberta. And so it’s like they do need each other. And if we’re being honest, Alberta is incredibly self-centered. She loves it when people are obsessed with her. She loves it in the same way she’s always talking about Al Capone wanting to date her and all these other bootleggers and gangsters in the 1920s. She’s obsessed with fame, and she loves to be the center of attention. And so it is truly a toxic match made in heaven. And what I will say is Rodrigo Fernandez Stoll is such a genius at “creepy” Todd. This episode, when he was doing his scenes, it took us everything not to break character.

Ghosts, Season 5, Thursdays, 8:30/7:30c, CBS